Well, as noone seems to be posting any answers and it's all questions, I thought I'd better try & do my own research. I have got hold of a brochure from a current SIPPS provider (inc commercial property) -it is an old brochure - 2001/2 but I am going to ring them tomorrow as I assume they will be doing the new SIPPS scheme. I do not have any personal connection with this company - my colleague went to one of their seminars a couple of years ago. Their details if anyone is interested are: Winterthur (part of Credit Suisse Group) 0845 3100122 (South) 0845 3100144 (North) - that's if they are still there, www.simplysipps.co.uk. Their brochure is extremely detailed and technical, it answers most questions on the existing SIPPS product that they offer.
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| Jo King (Lite Member) | Possible SIPPS provider |
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Posted: Feb 10 05 19:56 Total Posts: 319 Users Rating: unrated |
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| Jacqui (Lite Member) | SIPPS - own research |
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Posted: Feb 11 05 19:33 Total Posts: 8 Users Rating: unrated |
I agree - there doesn't seem to be anyone out there to answer the questions! Here is an article we scanned in from a Sundy paper a couple of years ago. It is about commercial property, but presumably similar rules will apply. I did call the number at the end, but I think it was just a list of FAs in my area, rather than SIPPS experts. "FOR landlord Arthur John, the Cresselly Arms pub is more than just his living, its his pension, too. Arthur, 54, worked for 29 years for Royal London Assurance, latterly as an area manager, and had long wanted to leave insurance to become a self-employed publican. He chose the start of the new millennium as the perfect time for the move. The pub he wanted to buy was this picturesque 16th Century inn at Pontargothi, Dyfed, where he often helped out behind the bar. Its owners were ready to sell, but Arthur did not know how he was going to raise the money. Then he heard about a rarely used type of pension plan called a Sipp a Self Invested Personal Pension. Sipps allow braver investors to run their own pension funds and to hold a surprisingly wide range of assets within them. The assets may include commercial property, such as the pub Arthur wanted to buy. The owners of the Cresselly Arms were asking more than £300,000 for the business. Arthur says: I certainly did not have that sort of money to spend. But I realised I had a lot of ldoney in my pension fund about £325,000, built up over nearly 30 years. ARTHUR checked further into his pension fund and found that it had about £250,000 of assets that could be turned into cash, with a further £75,000 tied up in Serps, the State Earnings Related Pension Scheme, which he could not draw on until he reached 60. I heard that a Sipp would allow me to use assets in my fund to buy the pub, he says. It seemed an ideal solution to my problem. But when Arthur looked for expert advice, the first people he turned to could not help. The High Street banks he approached admitted they knew little about Sipps. Finally he found a specialist pensions adviser that did know about them, Francis Walls & Richards, based in Port Talbot, West Glamorgan. The adviser put him in touch with James Hay, a firm of pension trustees in Salisbury, Wiltshire, which set up a Sipp and transferred his fund. JUST over £200,000 from the Sipp was used to buy the bricks and mortar of the pub. Pension rules prohibited Sipp funds from being used for other parts of the business, so Arthur paid for the rest with other savings and a loan from Royal Bank of Scotland. Because the pension fund now owns the building, Arthur pays a commercial rent to the fund, which the trustees administer. Pensions adviser David Roderick, who guided Arthur through the purchase, says: The Sipp has not just helped Arthur buy a business he might otherwise not have been able to afford, it has given him strong tax advantages as well. The value of the property can grow tax-free within the pension fund, and if it is eventually sold, it will not be liable to capital gains tax. A property held in a Sipp is normally sold when the holder decides to retire and draw a pension. The proceeds of the sale are used to buy a pension annuity, producing income for life. But if the pension holder cannot or does not want to sell the property on retirement, the rules allow it to be let to someone else. The rent is used by the administrator to provide the pension holder with an income. Sipp rules say that the trustee or Sipp manager must oversee everything, and the pension holder must pay fees for the running of the Sipp, which can vary widely between providers. Sipps are not designed only for business people who want to hold commercial property in them, they are also aimed at keen investors who want to run their own pension portfolios rather than have them managed by pension companies. For details of independent financial advisers who specialise in Sipps, call IFA Promotion on 0800 085 3250."
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| Jo King (Lite Member) | Thanks Jacqui |
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Posted: Feb 12 05 13:01 Total Posts: 319 Users Rating: unrated |
That was very interesting & useful. It confirms what I read yesterday in the 'Tax Tips' newsletter - you have to have sufficient money/assets in the SIPP fund to enable the fund to purchase the Property - you cannot simply transfer the property to a new fund that has no assets. Hence the problem that if you buy property now with the intention of selling to the fund in April06 (if you are lucky enough to have a SIPP in place with sufficient money in it) then if property increases in value between now and then you may incur tax on the capital gain when the SIPP purchases it from you, aswell as the fund paying Stamp Duty & Fees etc. I also read that the Fund Manager will often agree to use the assets to raise further loans to buy more assets but only at commercial rates - these tend to be a bit higher than the deals you can get on BTL mortgages at the moment.
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| Philip Wye (Lite Member) | SIPPs |
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Posted: Feb 16 05 14:43 Total Posts: 6 Users Rating: unrated |
Another firm that's well up to speed on SIPPS is Pointon York with their SIPP Solutions package. They are independant of the insurance industry cf Winterthur, which I think is a good thing... and they are particularly well up on the commercial, and pending residential property aspect of SIPPS regarding the purchase and administration of property within the SIPP etc.. I'm in the process of signing with them right now...tel: 0116 255 1234 www.sippsolutions.com
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| Jo King (Lite Member) | SIPPS |
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Posted: Feb 17 05 11:57 Total Posts: 319 Users Rating: unrated |
Thanks Philip - very useful.
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| Laurie (Lite Member) | Excellent book on SIPPS |
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Posted: Feb 17 05 12:22 Total Posts: 30 Users Rating: unrated |
I've found a really brilliant book that answers loads of questions re: SIPPS, with plenty of examples and straightforward text. My partner and I both read it straight through in a day. It's from Tax Cafe (taxcafe.co.uk), and it's called 'Retire Rich with a Property Pension.' I'm in no way connected with tax cafe, but I found this really useful. From what I can see, a property SIPP is only good if you have a lot of money in your pension fund. From April 2006, you will only be able to borrow UP TO 50% of the value of your pension. So if you have £100K in your pension fund, you will be able to buy a £150K property, by borrowing 1/3 of the money. It seems to me that my money's not working very hard for me if that's the best leveraging I can get. Have I missed the point? Laurie
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